I have only one question: Wouldn't these missile TE/TCs put even Light missile engagement ranges well past 100 km mark - would that be intended?

I think it's the same kind of issue as the base drone stats staying unchanged IIRC on the introduction of DDAs.

its an issue on a caracal yes.

but a kestrel is a different story. kestrel vs corm, the kestrel has far better lock range.

a kestrel vs harpy, the kestrel has better range. a kestrel can hit targets at 97km just using rigs.

ive got a kessy right now thats cap stable with a lock range at 126km, a top speed of 2815m/s, and a missile range of 97km.

these new computers will increase my range even further.

For that to happen you need proper targets fro them (BC sized).

And btw.. when in hell you see turret battleships so much? They are rare as well :P

Can't put rigors everywhere.
For example, a fleet ham sacrilege gets very interesting gains with MGCs, and it has no slots to spare for any missile rigs.
I imagine phoon would benefit greatly from this stuff too.

Stacking penalty, what is it?

So I've been trying to keep stacking penalties in the discussion as much as possible when it comes to these modules, since it seemed ambiguous at first how they'd apply, especially considering that currently missile rigs are exempt from these penalties.

I was hoping that a lack of stacking penalties wouldn't make the modules too overpowered, especially for the ganky crap I pull off, but also that stacking wouldn't be so oppressive that people would be forced to use the new modules just to stay in the same place as before.

Seeing both stacking penalties AND stat decreases at once seems like a very big swing. Having one or the other may have left more fitting options open -- but having both nerfs will render current application fits less powerful and force new fits to dedicate more slots to their cause.

In shorthand:

• New powerful mods + new stacking penalties: Good
• New nerfed mods + old non-penalized stacking: Good
• New powerful mods + old non-penalized stacking: Overpowered
• New nerfed mods + new stacking penalties: Underpowered

For anyone not crippled in the logic department, say CCP Rise, who is reading this far down the balance discussion, here's my concerns.

1) Wolf-Rayets.
What crazy crack pipe is TF smoking? The RLML Cerb crack pipe, where RLML fits in Wolf Rayet wormholes look like:
6 x RLML
MWD
3 x MGC's
SeBo's
3 x BCU
1 x MGE
Bay Thruster rig
T2 Calefaction
C6 Wolf Rayet you will be getting 1621 DPS, with no need for a tank, you're shooting at 140km with perfect precision!

2) Black Holes
C4 Black Hole (cause no one lives C5-C6 much) Cruise Phoons packing 2 MGC's and 2 MGE's. Riht now you get 152m explosion radius and 223m/s explosion velocity. With those EWAR mods on, and 3 rigor rigs you'll get that down to 120m / 275m/s. That's....light missile territory, with 688 DPS cruise missiles (200km range) on a battleship. Not bad, you have to admit, but getting a bit broken.

Let alone a shield Barghest with souped up lows and rigs. Right now C4 BH it's 29km/s velocity. With MGE's you''ll top 32km/s, and better than 230m radius, 200m/s explosion velocity.

But, finally, the Torp Cavalry Raven is back on the cards!!!1!
Fully tricked out, you can et the torp Raven in a C4 BH to HML-levels of application, without going over the top. All you need, really, are webs, and you've suddenly got 1200 DPS out to 70km with pretty much decent application vs cruisers. Arguably it's what the Raven needs, but we're talking torp Ravens.

I remain to be convinced that we need these modules AT ALL, given the above edge cases. Sure, it's not like C6 W-R Cerbs will blot out the sun in nullsec (least until you make the supercarriers into the hypothesised broadcasters of system effects....pls do this, it would be awesome) but W-R fighting is already basically who can bring a bunch of RLML damping ships to the hole first, very boring and lame game play.

So, please at least run these through your calculators, CCP Rise, and consider whether it's a good idea.

I concur and eagerly look forward to CCP Rise's statement on the matter. Otherwise, Plan B[1]...


[1] Which is start a mega whine thread about getting my missile skills refunded.

Missiles must have been OP for CCP to decide to nerf them again.

The amount of negativity every single person in this thread exudes is absolutely mind boggling.

tl;dr I hate people who do nothing but whinge and ***** about every little thing and talk about how bad it's going to be. Yes it sucks that torps and cruise are still pretty bad. Yes it'd be nice to have more active dev feedback. But my god, you people sound like a bunch of whiney silver spooning shitlords.